Curse

Stayfrosty · May 10, 2007, 01:50 AM // 01:50

Ive been doing some experimenting in RA with my sin
[Stayfrostys Sin's Skills;OwFkQxVynOiDWxvAYCMfMC4BU/B]
[Axe sin;OwFkIxV43NiDWBOOVkK2uAg+TAA]
Thats what ive got so far, yes im aware theres no res sig, yes im aware its the best skill in the game.
Aside from that I feel the build has been doing fairly well, I have absolutely fallen in love with beguiling Haze as my elite. I dont have nightfall, but I plan to buy it and I will replace sever with Barbatious strike.

I just got bored of always using daggers so I wanted to try something fresh new (not to mention how cool fellblades look on assassins) and not so cookie cutter. Give me some input on what you think/what I could improve.
Edit: you can copy/paste the code in game to see build but here it is as per request
[sword build]
Flurry
Sever
Gash
Final Thrust
Beguiling Haze{E}
way of perfection
Shroud of Distress
Critical eye
Swordsmanship : 12
shadow arts 10+1
Critical strikes 8+3+1
res into tactics

[Axe build]
Flurry
Penetrating blow
Penetrating chop
Eviscerate{E}
Shadowy Burden
Healing signet
Critical eye
Res sig
Axe mastery : 12
shadow arts 7+1
Critical strikes 8+3+1
tactics 8

Coloneh · May 10, 2007, 03:04 AM // 03:04

why dont you post the build, the code dosnt help me much.

also axe and scythe sins = good idea (high crits)
sword sins = very stupid

Yanman.be · May 10, 2007, 05:35 AM // 05:35

Scythe/hammer sins or nothing.

Dutch Masterr · May 10, 2007, 03:23 PM // 15:23

Its kind of pointless for a sin to use any melee weapon other than daggers because assassins are well....very vulnerable to any sort of damage =D....You need to be able to take down a target before they can take you down and thats something swords and axes cant do with the skills they come with. Critical strikes wont help you much on increasing damage either since you are still only at 12 swordsmanship/axe mastery, while a warrior at 15 or 16 weapon mastery would be doing damage in the 80s-100s commonly.

Coloneh · May 10, 2007, 09:05 PM // 21:05

you have obviously never been hit with wild blow ONCE from a scythe, that at least 100ish damage. now switich to assasin primary, add in WotA, and critical eye, now your getting a critical on nearly every hit. dont tell me thats bad dps, and critical defenses + mystic regen keeps me alive pretty well.

XvArchonvX · May 10, 2007, 10:00 PM // 22:00

Being able to increase the frequency of crits may increase damage, but I am skeptical as to if it would do so enough to compensate for the potential damage lost from running at 12 weapon mastery as opposed to 16. I VERY highly doubt that it would exceed this. Even if it would, the increased damage would likely be very small and not necessarily enough to merit running this on an assassin and having to use a skill slot for Crit Eye.

Could the concept be fun? Probably, but I'm pretty sure you don't see 'sins running around with warrior or dervish weapons in high end PvP for a reason...

Coloneh · May 11, 2007, 05:07 AM // 05:07

because a sin with daggers can bring down a single target REALLY fast. in PvE hitting 3 criticals at once is quite useful.

FoxBat · May 11, 2007, 04:54 PM // 16:54

It's the same principle as barrage rangers really... except for the fact that you can't get a decent IAS on hammers/scythes, which is typically more effective in PvE. That and a spammable Deep Wound elite > WotA.

Stayfrosty · May 11, 2007, 05:26 PM // 17:26

Im up for doing some testing with a stopwatch for weapon vs weapon testing.
Keep in mind I dont have nightfall yet.
Heres what I would do in the great temple of balthazar test zone
Time how long it takes to kill the target.
The Adren skills I use will be the ones specified in my first post.
VS 100al target
Plain attack w/ crit eye(no adren skills used)
flurry w/ crit eye(no adren skills used)
plain attack w/ crit eye(use adren skills)
flurry w/ crit eye(use adren skills)

VS 60al target
Plain attack w/ crit eye(no adren skills used)
flurry w/ crit eye(no adren skills used)
plain attack w/ crit eye(use adren skills)
flurry w/ crit eye(use adren skills)

For the sin I will test sword/axe/daggers
then Repeat these for a warrior with 16 mastery and 13str but with sword/axe no daggers here and no critical eye

I will do 10 trials of each list each trial here when im done then average them.

The swords/axe/daggers I use will be max dmg 15always customized but will not have any mods such as sundering or +skills (might test later if I have time)

This might take some time to do and I wont be home until later today so Ill try to finish this sometime A.S.A.P.

I think those are fair test methods.

Cirian · May 11, 2007, 05:44 PM // 17:44

For the more casual end of PvP like Alliance Battle you can run whatever you want, so you could do something really weird like Critical Defences + Hundred Blades + Frenzy, and for a couple of seconds (before you explode) it might be awesome. I mean I don't think there's a seriously competitive sword sin build out there waiting to be discovered, but I think there are certainly some "fun" builds you could run just for the thrill of it. Oh... oh, yes, and you get to Shield Bash, which is a form of entertainment unto itself.

The bottom line for fighting single targets is that you just won't beat using daggers as a sin. Just look at Twisting Fangs - it's kinda like your whole sever-gash-final sword chain in one crazy-good move, and it frees two slots at the same time. I think you'd have to develop at a totally different fighting style that moved you away from the traditional warrior or sin. Like, concentrate on AoE or multi-attack techniques + buffs (possibly from team mates, eg rit weapon buffs etc.) Hundred Blades, Triple Chop + Cyclone Axe, a Scythe specialist etc. I doubt it'd ever be great, but it could be fun - which is why you should go do it anyway!

Edit: on Isle of the Nameless

Personally when I test on IotN I like to test endurance as well as raw killing power - like, those 4 barrels? Drop them one after the other in sequence and see if you can have them all killed before the first one has respawned. Little games like that keep testing fun and you can get a feel for the builds you make like how energy intensive it is, how easy it is to move from target to target without the pressure dropping, the effects of armour on your build, blah blah blah, little nuances you didn't think of when you threw the bar together. Even just the comfort of pushing the buttons.

Oh, and the 4 barrel game? Moebius sin with Twisting Fangs and Critical Strike. I think I'd cry if I tried it with a sword after that. Still, good luck!

Dutch Masterr · May 12, 2007, 03:35 PM // 15:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

you have obviously never been hit with wild blow ONCE from a scythe, that at least 100ish damage. now switich to assasin primary, add in WotA, and critical eye, now your getting a critical on nearly every hit. dont tell me thats bad dps, and critical defenses + mystic regen keeps me alive pretty well.

I meant with an assassin...yes with a dervish or warrior primary there is good spike potential.

Coloneh · May 12, 2007, 09:41 PM // 21:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutch Masterr

I meant with an assassin...yes with a dervish or warrior primary there is good spike potential.

that had nothing to do with dervishes or warriors. i was pointing out he incredible damage of criticals on a scythe.

ginganinja · May 13, 2007, 05:25 AM // 05:25

assassins using other weapons besides daggers in pvp? i wouldn't do it personally....BUT...

solo farming using axes is quite effective...when i began playing this game i didn't even take money making into account...and so after i leveled my sin i desperately wanted money to get new armour...needless to say i was having alot of trouble soloing ANYTHING with my daggers...so i searched the net for decent assassin soloing builds

and found one...

on youtube....theres loads of videos of the same build there...if someone could let me know who made this build please tell me...i want to thank them

anyways....sorry if this build is already somewhere else in the forums...i havnt found it yet...

cyclone axe
triple chop (elite)
wild blow
critical eye
way of perfection
critical defences
shadow refuge
any other skill (i usually use dash or dark escape...)

shadow arts 12
critical strikes 12
axe mastery 10

its pretty self explanatory reely....keep all the enchantments on...with 12 shadow arts and critical strikes you should be able to activate critical eye and way of perfection as soon as they run out.activate shadow refuge every now and again...and if, on the offchance critical defenses runs out, be prepared to leg it.
This build only really works against melee enemies. I wouldnt recommend fighting casters as critical defences obviously doesnt help against spells lol
The other problem is the somewhat poor damage. Sure...u could survive against 8-9 enemies (maybe more...ive not tried) but if you're fighting a boss with health regen (the ranger troll in the troll caves springs to mind) its an almost never ending battle.

if the person who created this build is reading this....PLEASE KNOW I TAKE NO CREDIT FOR THIS!!!

Hole Sale Traps · May 13, 2007, 08:21 AM // 08:21

I was in a RA group with her a few days ago (We got to 7-8 but lost )....O.o Nice build its something diffrent but maybe it can be used for a better effect in PvE.

ginganinja · May 14, 2007, 01:43 PM // 13:43

yeah its a fun build to play...especially as if you keep critical defenses up you can finish a fight with full health

im not sure how other people would feel about choice of weapons and armour...but im using nightstalkers armour...i was going to use shrouded for the extra energy...but after i got wing's axe energy management wasnt really a problem...you should get about 4 energy for each crit...and 1 or 2 energy for every non-crit...and because you'll (hopefully) be fighting more then one mob...that means you should always have near full energy.
so yeah....zealous axe....maybe with a 20% increase on enchant time....but im not too fussy about that

jouninassasin · May 15, 2007, 02:40 AM // 02:40

ya, you'll need critical defenses if you're tanking with a sin :P

Mesmer in Need · May 15, 2007, 03:14 AM // 03:14

Helooooooo.... Critical chop anyone?
With the high chance of critical hitting with a sin and the high damage of a scythe or axe's critical hits, i think it would make a good build for a sythe/axe sin.

ginganinja · May 18, 2007, 02:26 AM // 02:26

critical chop for PvP? i dont know...i dont think i could bring myself to use any weapons other then daggers for PvP....

and PvE....i just cant reely see the point...

maybe im just an idiot...

ShadowsRequiem · May 18, 2007, 02:28 AM // 02:28

lol your build(op) looks just like the joke sin build I was running in ab just so I could be a ninja >_>

was a long time ago, but I cant see them really using anything besides daggers, much less al, most likely not nearly as much dmg output, though having lots of crits would be nice.

but for pve i see why not lol.

ginganinja · May 18, 2007, 02:38 AM // 02:38

i really only use the build i listed for farming purposes...i see no other point to using it...

the effectiveness of using axe sins to farm in my opinion comes from hitting multiple targets...because it just means more healing+crits which means longer survival.

but...lets be honest...it would be easier to use a warrior

straying from daggers on an assassin is like sacrilege :P